Problem with 30 bottle kits.

Termite

Hi - I've been making wine for a while, but ended up stopping making the larger kits as I always had problems. Recently I've been making the small kits and had some great bottles of white wine (Chardonnay). The youngs kit was excellent.

So I thought I'd jump back to a 30 bottle kit, the Cellar 7. But again - on finish there is this slightly off (sour?) taste? 

Everything is steralised fine, its made correctly - but just has this off taste. I keep thinking it must be that too much air is getting in there causing it to oxidise?

It's a shame as I really want to make the cost effective 30 bottle kits - but any suggestions?

I don't want to make 5 x 6 bottle kits as it is alot more expensive and more time consuming.

Everything else I make (beer, cider etc) is fine. Just the 30 bottle wine kits I struggle with

TIA

Matt

HBO_Staff

Hi Matt, this is unusual and hard to say, the wine ingredients are usually the same in the 6 and 30 bottle versions, the first thing we would try and rule out is the equipment used, we wonder if the vessel you use for a larger batch is imparting any flavour into the wine, and perhaps the smaller batches you make are in a different vessel? Sometimes old vessels can have the sides worn from cleaning etc, but if the sides are smooth and the vessel is clean then this may rule that out too. The vessels must be suitable for food use and be made of food grade PET plastic so as not to impart any flavours. It is quite likely that the main difference between making the smaller and larger batches is the vessel you use, most other equipment will be the same. If you store the finished wine in the same bottles for either batch size then that would suggest they are not the problem either. 

One other thing that we sometimes hear is that a brew has a slightly unusual smell or taste in the early stages, this will disappear as the brew conditions in the bottles, depending on how long it has been made for it may be worth leaving in the bottles for longer and seeing if this helps

Termite

I'm using Young's large fermenting containers and they seem fine (always clean). Ciders/beers all come out fine. . just the wine.

Can wine get too much "air" ie when transferring from containers, degassing, bottling etc?

Matt

Termite

Oh just to add - I've used multiple different kits with a similar problem, I've changed fermenting bins as well. . its weird

HBO_Staff

You should try to minimise contact with air and ensure it is thoroughly degassed before bottling, perhaps try changing steriliser to a non rinse version such as this; http://www.home-brew-online.com/equipment-c40/cleaning-c56/brew-safe-cleaner-sanitiser-no-rinse-240g-p1347

It would be interesting to know how long the wine is in the bottles before you open it and try and it has the off taste, and does the flavour get worse if left for a few weeks longer or not change?

Termite

I've got that steriliser  

With the 6 bottle kits, the wine honestly tastes great from the start and matures nicely. This wine tastes "wrong" from the start. . and tbh bottling it and leaving it seems to get worse . . .well certainly doesn't get better.

I'm sure its something my end (ie not the kits fault) but infuriating as I do enjoy my wine (ie drink lots) and it was one of the key reasons I started wine making. I'm currently self sufficient with wine, beer, cider & spirits. This is my only real problem!

HBO_Staff

This is a strange one, here is a help guide from Youngs which has some common problems and causes and solutions;

http://www.youngsubrew.co.uk/brewers support.htm

Possible reasons could include storing in direct light, ideally the wine would be stored in the dark, a high temperature during fermentation could potentially produce an off flavour so always try to keep the wine within the temperatures recommended on the instructions (often 20 degrees C or so). The wine ingredients should be stored away from anything that has a strong odour such as washing powders, cleaning chemicals, etc, as they have been known to impart a flavour into other goods stored nearby. 

If all else fails it may be worth trying a different vessel to ferment in to be sure that is also ruled out